Tuesday, 25 October 2011

For ever

Suppose that, instead of orgasm denial lasting for a day, or a week, or even a little more (hard enough for most girls, I think), just suppose it lasted much, much longer. Suppose it lasted for a month, or even several months. That would be a real test of obedience. This would put any girl, even the most submissive, on her mettle. I can imagine the whining and mewling, the heartfelt pleas for mercy, the anguished cries of frustration, even the anger at the unfairness of it all. But maybe, if you have submissive leanings and denial is something you respond to (I don’t say welcome; I don’t think any girl wants it, not really, it’s just that when it’s imposed it has its compensations…), then even such a draconian regime might be bearable, given enough training, given enough determination by the dom, that you will bend the knee to him, no matter how much you protest.

But, now I’m going to ask you to think the unthinkable. What I’ve been talking about up till now is not unimaginable, even though probably 99% of submissive girls would never volunteer for anything as severe as a period of denial lasting several months. But just suppose instead of a fixed-term embargo on orgasm, that he decreed a life sentence. Suppose he said, you are never going to come again. You will get close to it, you will never stop wanting it, but orgasm will always be denied. Without exception. Without time off for good behaviour. Without any prospect of release. This is what I want, and I think that, however much you resist, you want and need it too. Ultimately you will thank me, after you have stopped hating me.

Is this, do you think, the way that madness lies? Could only a lunatic try to implement such complete and utter control? And would only a lunatic accept it? I’ll say one thing; it’s certainly a game-changer, isn’t it? No more negotiations. No more, if I am a very good girl, if I say pretty please, will you let me come? No more counting down the days until the end of the period of denial, dreaming of the mother of all orgasms once the ban is lifted. Just an endless future of orgasmlessness stretching out in front of you.

Of course there would be pleasure. It’s not that you couldn’t masturbate. He’d let you touch, from time to time, just so long as he trusted you to stop before it was too late. There would be other pleasures too. The pleasure of pain, for example, that deep-down need you have to be whipped until your ass is red and raw, or have your nipples twisted until the sweat breaks out on your brow. There would be the pleasure of servicing his orgasms. Because don’t think that for one moment he’s going to join you in denial, out of some spirit of fellow-feeling. On the contrary, knowing that you are denied only arouses him the more.

And then of course there is the purest pleasure of all, the pleasure of knowing that you are doing his will. That you are making this supreme sacrifice for him, the renunciation of that moment of jouissance, that spasm of ecstasy. You become a nun, one of the sisters of submission, dedicating yourself to service, denying yourself the relief of your desires in perpetuity. (If you’d like to do a little reading round this topic, I suggest you go here: http://agonizingabstinence.blogspot.com/)

Of course the dom that makes you do this recognises his responsibilities. It’s a tough ask, no? So he vows to give you all the time and attention that you need if your resolve is not to weaken. He knows how much this is costing you, how very, very hard it will be. And he’s willing to dedicate himself to managing you. He knows that in exchange for your sacrifice you will need reassurance, encouragement, praise, admiration. He’s not going to issue his edict and then park you somewhere on your own, locked in a cold dark cell (though maybe a secret part of you might even welcome that; I have never under-estimated the perversity of submissive girls). He’s going to make you feel it’s worth it, making the ultimate sacrifice.

Thinking about all this, I begin to wonder if being under sentence of permanent orgasm-denial would give one a whole new perspective on physical pleasure, and on submission. You wouldn’t be quite the same person, would you? I suspect it would affect every aspect of your sexuality, which would be no longer goal-oriented (when can I come again? is this going to get me off quicker? etc, etc). Instead, it’s about reaching a particular state of mind, what the religious call a state of grace. What that would feel like I’m not quite sure. I‘d need to talk to a girl who had achieved it. But I don’t think that is likely any time soon. Even though the idea of it might intrigue you, I don’t think I’ve sold you on it, have I.

22 comments:

hissassykitty said...

"I suspect it would affect every aspect of your sexuality, which would be no longer goal-oriented (when can I come again? is this going to get me off quicker? etc, etc). Instead, it’s about reaching a particular state of mind, what the religious call a state of grace. What that would feel like I’m not quite sure."

While I am not deliberately kept in that state of "denial" I very rarely come on my own, and can count on one hand the amount of times I have come with a partner in the last 15 years.
It does make you think differently of your submission, because while you can still enjoy everything, and get turned on to the point of pain, there is no "happy ending" so instead, you concentrate on being everything he asks you to be, for his pleasure, as his pleasure then becomes the WHOLE point. And not something that just leads to your pleasure in the end.

Vesta said...

Not at all, I'm afraid. I'm into peace. But, I'm also into pleasure. Where is all that pent up energy going to go? I have never even been convinced that nuns don't masturbate and orgasm. It would be the fastest way to have me running for that door. You wouldn't see me for the dust.

goodgirl said...

Hello Discerning Dom,
I have heard of orgasm denial since the beginning of my D/s journey and I actually know of a woman who has gone 7 years so far without reaching climax. After speaking with said woman she has told me she is happy, content, pleased to bring such pleasure to her Master. That exchange works for them but would it work for everyone? Would it work for me? Not certain.

I have gone months, close to an entire year without an orgasm, without masturbating or touching myself in any manner other than to bathe myself and I was happy and living a life of love and joy. I did not have a significant other during that time either so that might have been why it was as easy as it was not to have an orgasm. Since being with my Master I have gone as long as 3 months without masturbating or climaxing, not because I was denied but simply I was not interested. I have also gone without an orgasm for 2 weeks due to denial but during that time I was instructed to bring myself to the very edge but stop. This I minded. This I minded a great deal. Fortunately for me I was eventually allowed pleasure and I knew there would be an end to the torture so that added to the pleasure. There was a "reward" of sorts at the end of my sacrifice which made it pleasurable - to give to Master in that way.

Now, to give it up for the rest of my life solely because it made him happy? I do not believe that would work for me - I think I would feel resentment because there is no purpose other than his selfishness and that is not enough for me.

Very interesting concept and I am certain some would love it. I on the other hand would not.

~a

sin said...

Such an interesting topic, I just posted something similar, linking here. I think your link to Agonizing Abstinence is broken for some reason, at least it didn't work when I tried it! You have such an elegant way with words.

Lily said...

One (potential) problem: consistent denial of orgasm is very likely to result in a diminished sex drive.

discerningdom said...

Sorry I can't get the link to work, though if you google agonizing abstinence you will find it. Blogspot seems to have some problems right now. Sometimes my blog won't load properly, but if you click reload it does.

FeministSub said...

You might want to read the book "As She's Told." It's about a quite extreme D/s couple and the female sub goes *months* without orgasm.

Personally, I would never agree to such an arrangement!

naughtyinaustin said...

i would have to think very hard about the motivation of someone who is supposed to care about my overall well-being in even suggesting such a thing. why would someone who loved me want me to forever go without one of the most pleasurable things life has to offer? absolute deal-breaker, no doubt about it. i love to serve, but i'm not going to deny myself an entire lifetime of orgasms for someone else's amusement, or even to reach a 'state of grace'. also, there has to be diminishing returns on the idea of a heightened state of arousal. i think eventually my whole sex drive would dissipate out of sheer self-defense. so yeah, orgasms and chocolate, definite deal breakers:)

Anonymous said...

While my husband was deployed, I went 2 years without coming. Not because he asked me not to. He did not say to me at any point; " you do not have permission to come". I don't think he would ever say such a thing to me. For me, it was just not really wanting to, or needing to, while he was not here. I don't think it is ever a question of whether you can or can't go without. I think it's easier for women, actually, to do so. You just have to have a reason. If that reason happens to be because the man you are with is a Dom and it's his wish that you do so, than the question isn't whether you can or not, it's whether you will or not. I imagine it's the same for anything relating to D/s; "Yes I will let you do that to me" or "no I won't let you do that to me".

I mean, *our* nuts aren't going to explode. I had a great many other things to attend to while he was away and since he's been home, he has more than made up for that small sacrifice. It was simple, really, especially in the shadow of his own.

Deep down, I believe that it all comes down to love. Do I love you enough?

Telling post, to be sure.

ally said...

I'm not sure such a thing would work on me. After no stimulation for a few weeks, I once had an orgasm from a few well-placed threats, a kiss (on the mouth), and a twisted nipple

*Serious reader* said...

Not sold... but one might consider it, if, as you say, the dom can keep his side of it: giving her all the attention she wants. but if he can't live up to that, she starts to feel it's a one-sided game, with no gain for her (except the thought of pleasing him, as you say - but being as human as he is, such vicarious pleasure can only go so far before it palls). If he could make it work, however: I guess she could change... adapt... eventually, to get to a point where nothing delights her unless he takes pleasure in it also... and so, if he did not take pleasure in her cumming, she would not want to anymore.

blueeyedvagabond said...

I wonder, what do you envision the mental end state to be of a woman in this kind of situation? It is indeed about reaching a particular state of mind. In fact, if you're talking about the real deal and not some kind of game that doms and subs play, it's imperative that you do reach that state of mind.

In fantasy, perhaps, that might be some kind of sacrificially induced, nirvana-like bliss (or for the more sadistically oriented, maybe an endless state of ravening need). In reality, though, and speaking from experience, it is nothing like a state of grace.

As your Anonymous commenter says, it’s not a question of whether you can or not, it’s whether you will or not. And once you say you will, then what happens isn't an ever-unsatisfied hunger, but the opposite.

If I don't orgasm, for whatever reason, what happens is a gradual diminution of desire that has little to do with wanting to please and everything to do with (literally) self preservation. Willing oneself out of desire can be done. My experience is like that of Anonymous' – if you have a good enough reason, you just do it. You focus on other things, and then you realize it's been years since you had an orgasm.

But then, I wonder, too, what would be the point? Even assuming it's something the submissive is willing to do (though I wholly agree with naughtyinaustin that it smacks of a gross disregard of the submissive, but that's just me)(and naughty), how much pleasure does the dominant get from denying something to his sub that she no longer cares about or wants? Then it's not even denial, but a pro-forma gesture. What does he do when she no longer gets excited by masturbating? Punish her by making her come?

She can still like being thrashed; she can still like sucking cock, or being fucked or "servicing his orgasms." She simply no longer cares about her own. Or is that the point? He’s doing it for the greater good, since he believes ,“This is what I want, and I think that, however much you resist, you want and need it too”?

Orgasms aren't like food; going without doesn't necessarily make you either hungry or transcendental. It can make you apathetic.

Fille said...

hmmm. a dom that desires no more orgasms from his fucktoy?

seems to me he'd be better served with a blow up doll.

Anonymous said...

He put me on forever orgasm denial.. with Him. Some might call it a break up, but forever orgasm denial sounds much more romantic <3

Anonymous said...

er that sort of makes me feel sick, that is just bullshit.no one should be ever tricked into thinking thats an okay thing to agree too, that is not the makings of a relationship. or a life. this actully sickens me and i will liken it to abuse, how much brainwashing would you have to do to convince someone of that , it equals mental abuse

and im not anit D/s

doll said...

I am no longer so certain how I feel about this. Giving orgasms to a man involves so much effort that I can imagine a wonderful state of peace when that is no longer required. And I have observed that I achieve a great deal more in life when I do not use up time masturbating. It does though involve a change of state so that sexual activity no longer holds the same appeal and gets sidelined in favour of other fine things in life.

Anonymous said...

I can't imagine the level of selflessness that this would require. Perhaps, if you'd never come at all then it might be a situation of; " you can't miss what you've never had", but that most likely wouldn't be the case for a submissive. No, this would require an almost hypnotic control over another human being. And then you'd have to delve deeply into the inner workings of the mind of anyone who would ask this of another while still wanting and requiring, really, the active participation of the denied in achieving their own satisfaction. I can't imagine that person being able to maintain their end of it by providing this 'unending' attention and care. Frankly, I can't imagine a person capable of asking for this level of commitment from someone else to even depended upon to bring that person an aspirin if their head ached.

Betsy said...

I would like to suggest, to those who believe they would eventually lose interest, lose their sexual drive out of self-preservation, that the dom (if he's sadistically inclined) wouldn't allow that to happen. It wouldn't be a situation like turning off one's sexuality. I think the dom would make it so that the submissive was ever aware of her denial, tormenting her mentally and physically (by making her edge over and over again) so that she can't focus on other things long enough to forget about her need, or for it to diminish.

I've read some of the posts on the blog Agonizing Abstinence, and it does seem that some of the girls on there get a certain deal of pleasure from long-term denial. And for them, it isn't that they've lost interest. In fact, most of them write about how wet it makes them, how they experience a more constant-state of arousal. So it isn't as simple as "You will not orgasm forever, therefore you better stop thinking about it at all."

And while we highly-sexed girls might be appalled by the idea that we might never orgasm again, can you really deny that a dom with that kind of power doesn't hold some appeal to you even in the darkest recesses of your mind? Sure, in reality, it might be a deal breaker. But I think we can all admit we've had a fair few fantasies that probably play more to the extremes than we would care to admit. This is no different. It's just an extreme we would, perhaps, never want to experience. In reality. But in fantasy? Maybe we should think about it.

Alice said...

"You will have no more orgasms" - because I want it that way, or for sake of being perfectly submissive - is a fantasy that can only work in reality by reducing a woman's relationship with her sexuality to the same level as that an anorexic has with food. Her healthy appetite is completely destroyed - one wonders who would be the winner?

grasshopper said...

@Betsy
I think that, while what you say about the dom keeping the sub on edge would work in theory, in practice the exigencies of real life would interfere. And, too, a lot of that "keeping on edge" activity is the sub keeping herself aroused, at the dom's direction, so it's quite possible for her to lose interest.

As for this being a deep dark fantasy, no, afraid not.

mamacrow said...

Hi, just unlurking to say that - years ago, the very thought of orgasm denial turned me completely off. Then more recently, it became more and more of fantasy for me - the agonizing absinance site is an interesting one, as is tantilism.org

its also important to draw a distinction here - not orgasming for a long time, and in that period not masturbating, not becomeing aroused, so gradually loosing your sex drive, is one thing. And it's definitely NOT what I'm talking about!

What I'm talking about is being arroused, touching, edging - just not getting to cum. What this does - for me - is make it so I'm more aroused more often for longer, become very aroused more quickly, and have (when denial comes to an end) a HUGE orgasm.

For me its a joy and an essential part of our sex life, although I would not want it to be permenant (except in a deep and dark fantasy that I sometimes use!).

my husband loves me cumming and loves making me cum, therefore to accomodate both of us, I have certain situations where I don't cum - I generally can only cum upstairs in bed with him unless I have permission, I (generally) ask to cum and to touch, and I don't get to cum for the duration of my period.

I say 'generally' alot because we are still at the begining of exploring this, and are monitoring the effects of it apon me and us carefully. Papacrow gets to override any of it any time he sees fit, and I get to call a halt and a relook at things also.

Yes, sometimes I start my period not feeling fantastic about the idea, but after several months of experimenting, this is all part of the fun and much nicer than, as it happens, cumming! Plus the payoff orgasm at the end of my period - totally worth it. What with age, stress, tiredness etc, sometimes my orgasms are less than explosive, so this is a fun way to get a huge one!

I guess what we do could be said to be more orgasm control than denial, it's something you could argue round the table about for some time :)

Anonymous said...

my Dom, allows me to cum on occasion but i am never allowed to ask for it, in fact i get punished if i ask to cum, that was only once but was a very effective punishment. But again He does allow me to cum but usually only while worshiping His ass, or while taking an enema from Him or while worshiping His feet, and during other various forms of humiliation. But when He does tell me to cum( i can cum on command) he always gives me 3 or more in a row. my most to date is 8 the last 3 squirting ones.
Its not often, and its not when i want or even think i could but the wait is always wroth it, and Master keeps me tantalized nearly all the time. it took a month of nightly sessions and rubber paddle swats that started at ten the most i have had to take was 30 , but i now can refrain for cumming no matter how long he toys with me or how long i must wait.